Monday, October 18, 2010

Well, I'm up early, absurdly early, so I have a few minutes to ruminate and what I want to ruminate about today is teh GAY. I can't imagine what it's like to be gay, any more than I can imagine what it's like to black. I have a number of friends who are gay and "out", I have a number of friends and acquaintances who are not "out", although they are not exactly "closeted", either. I have, to my knowledge, no openly gay relatives; then again, I don't spend a lot of time with my relatives as the nearest of them live about 500 miles away and most live a good deal farther away than that. I was born in 1949 when Jim Crow was the law of the land in the South (and, in practice, in many northern states as well). Black americans were presumed to be inferior and expected to be subservient and respectful of their "betters". People may well argue that this is not the case, they are wrong. When I was in school, at a catholic school with a very low "tuition" (about $12 a year when I was in grade school) there were few if any blacks in our student body--despite the fact that there were many blacks living within walking or busing distance. The church I attended had few black attendees, I don't know if there were any blacks who were parishoners. When I worked at one of several jobs I held as a teenager I worked with whites, almost exclusively. The only blacks I worked with were, in all but one instance, lower on the totem pole than I was--even if I was a new hire. Bigotry and prejudice were common and unremarkable amongst my classmates, my co-workers, my superiors, teachers, public officials and even my own family. I was made aware of my own bigotry when, while riding a public bus, I told a racist joke to some of my companions. They didn't laugh and I turned around to find a large, angry black woman looking sternly at me. She said, "Your mother would be ashamed of you for telling that story.". That was it, she turned away. I felt terrible, initially for being chastised and then, later, for having said what I had said. That incident took place just about 50 years ago and I've been working on acceptance, true acceptance of "the other"--to the point where there is no, "the other", ever since. Gays, or "queers", "homos", "fags" as we called them when I was younger, have had on the one hand, an easier time of "passing" than blacks--so long as they lived in denial of their desire to be genuinely who they are; on the other hand, they are still viewed by many people to be sick, aberrant, immoral or inferior. Gay bashing, literally, was a rite of passage for some jocks when I was in school, as was picking fights with the jewboys down at Central HS (oddly those same heroes rarely went down to the ghetto to look for trouble). Like blacks, gays have contributed much to our society. In the arts and sciences, public service, private business and education many inventions, innovations and improvements in processes have been the work of gay men and women. Like blacks they have often had their contributions downplayed or even ignored. When they have been recognized for their achievements they have often been unable to act as role models for other gays, without there being a backlash from the bigots and they have, in many cases, been subjected to verbal insults and physical threats simply because of their being gay. There is a tendency among us humans to look for a scapegoat, someone to bear the blame for the ills of our society. Down through the years it's been the easily identifiable "other"; the one with the funny name, odd speech patterns, strange customs, "wrong" faith or different skin color. Gays have had to deal with all of this; they have also had to deal with being misunderstood and hated for their sexual orientation--and, when being "out" for that alone. The RCC, many fundamentalist christians and muslims that preach a message of love and tolerance are intolerant, to the extreme of killing in the name of GOD, of those who are openly gay. The same is true of some governments that purport themselves to be inclusive. I am not gay, I'm fairly certain I would not enjoy having sex with a man. That I am not gay and don't think I would enjoy having sex with a man does not mean that I think someone who is gay and enjoys having sex with someone of the same sex is wrong. Consensual sexual relations between two willing adults is fine with me. So is a living arrangement, including a marriage (or a civil union--with exactly the same legal underpinnings) between two willing adults. I don't care what people do when they are in private or public as long as what they are doing is not a violation of the law for one group while it is acceptable for another. The whole DADT thing is, in a nutshell, bullshit; if you can fight and die for your country what difference does it make what you do on your downtime? I've been propositioned, sometimes rather forcefully, by gay men and my thoughts were "Man, what an asshole!" not, "Oh, noes, icky buttseks!". As a gay acquaintance once said when I asked him why the other guy just didn't get that I wasn't gay", "He doesn't care, to him, you're just a piece of meat." . In other words, he was just dealing with me the way a lot of guys deal with women--he didn't care about anything but his own wants. I got it. This piece is not intended to sway those who are afraid of, and therefor hate, gay people. They need professional help. If it makes those who already "tolerate" teh GAY move a little more in the direction of genuine acceptance, that would be a good thing.


Bukko Boomeranger said...

You're not gay? Dang, I thought you were. OK, now I don't like you so much ennymore.

Laci the Chinese Crested said...

Hey, if I want to play with a guy's cock--I can play with my own. Why bother with someone else's. On the other hand, if someone can only get off that way< I can't change them.

I have noticed that gays tend to be a lot more tolerant than straights (other than my a-hole neighbour, but he would be an a-hole if he were straight).

Anyway, when I was caught in bed with a female student on a school trip to London by some puritanical hotel staff, the gay teacher who was running the trip was pissed off at the hotel staff and told them off. We were over the age of consent (18) and it was none of their business to intrude.

democommie said...

I find the gay people that I have known are people, pretty much the same thing with blacks and other scary people--they're people. The only people I am genuinely intolerant of are those who are trying to force their way of life on me, as an individual or as a member of society at large.

Bukko Boomeranger said...

I was surfovating around the blogosphere and I came across one named "Beers with Demo." Thought it might be a friend of yours. But it seems to be some San Diego reichtards instead.

democommie said...

Bukko Canukko:

Oy, I looked. My bad. Reichtards disguised as "independents". Hate Obama, Pelose, any dem, any progressive thought. Deny reality so that you can do that hatin'.

If only taste in adult beverages was a bellwhether for sanity.

Flying Junior said...

You know demo, the right drugs, the right guy, nobody would ever find out...

I was smoking some weed with a young black gay guy once out on the patio of a cool gay bar in San Diego back in the seventies. He said he would like to take me home for sex. I was sort of flattered. He was nice.

But my real point is that any acceptance of gays has been a huge struggle, fought over the last twenty, thirty, maybe forty to fifty years. In my younger days, discrimination against gays was the norm. I once told a guy he couldn't rent a room unless he promised not to bring over any lovers. Today, a guy like him can get a good job and command a lot of respect. Conversely, my father, who is more of a natural liberal than myself, even back in the 1940s considered homosexuality a non-issue. Sadly, all the progress we have made towards equality and acceptance has been more than counterbalanced by asshole, phoney christians who tell their kids that God hates ....

There was none of that kind of institutionalized bullying in the old days.

Nomi said...

Some of human behavior is simply heartbreaking.
But this piece moved me to tears in a good way.
It saddens me how far we have to go, and when I think of all the anti-immigrant activity becoming the norm. . .
I posted a link to a lovely recent action in Boston....

Love, Love, Love , Nomi

p.s. I'm terribly sorry I missed your Birthday ! xoxox

mutzali said...

The fact that my younger brother was gay REALLY bothered my in-laws.
1. "How can you allow him around your CHILDREN???" um, the same way I allow you around them.
2. "What do you tell them about his sex life???" Um, the same thing I tell them about yours---that it's none of their business.
3. "You have to tell them he's going to hell!!!' No, really I don't.

I really liked my Mom's attitude: do what makes you happy, as long as you're not hurting anybody or being hurt. And don't do it in the street and scare the horses.

Unknown said...

Dear Flying Jr.-You know, it is really annoying when people presume to know what a Christian parent like myself, tells their sons about homosexuality. I will tell you so you quit spreading your lousy liberal lies. I tell them that God is the judge of everybody, not us. I tell them, from a medical standpoint, male homosexuality is a high risk lifestyle. When they were little and asked me what a guy did to be gay I told them that they put penises in their mouths or butts. They screamed and said "I will NEVER be gay." They aren't.

democommie said...


You're a sanctimonious idiot. Telling your sons that guys stick penises in their mouths or butts MAKES them gay is idiotic. Saying it AS IF millions (if not billions) of completely heterosexual females have not had penises put in their mouths or butts is sanctimonious--as well as being complete horseshit.


"Dear Flying Jr.-You know, it is really annoying when people presume to know what a Christian parent like myself, tells their sons about homosexuality. I will tell you so you quit spreading your lousy liberal lies. I tell them that God is the judge of everybody, not us"

btw, completely blows your cover. You are in fact doing that which you say you shouldn't be doing, judging others.

Do me, my other, more intelligent--and honest--readers and yourself a huge favor and STFU about shit you know absolutley nothing about.

Flying Junior said...

Thanks for proving my point Susan.

Just keep on loving those sinners and hating teh sin. False religion that breeds intolerance is really a drag for Jesus. He totally hates it.

And you're an icky mother. I can't believe you would say something like that to little boys. Yechh!

Nomi said...

I watched some of the hearings recently about the future "transition" away from "Don't Ask Don't Tell" and it was widely pathetic. To hear these military leaders pretend that there are not gay people in the military and that disharmony (! ) and "lack of cohesion" might occur, was to give me a clearer picture of the concept of the racially segregated military, and the resistance some (many?) offered to changing that and to the entry of women into the military. Really if ANY government worker in authority or in "defense" is afraid of gay men or women, those people really need help. Professional counseling. Perhaps anti-depressants or even anti-psychotics.
An English teacher of mine from a rural area shared with the class, that he was convinced as a child that Jewish people had horns (small ones) on their foreheads. We laughed. But the sad thing is that people are spreading this kind of "knowledge" about gay folks and immigrants, ( and holycow, some of the immigrants are gay !!)...
Why can't we all just get along ?

Richard said...

Merry Christmas, Democommie!

dog gone said...

Hello, all!

I've just joined democommie as an admin; mostly this was just because it was annoying to have to go through the captcha /anti-robot hassle to leave a comment.

But I am going to enjoy the opportunity to delete crap from those who write comments utterly lacking in substance or value.

Consider the two commenters who have written pointless boring crap and had it deleted put on notice. Yup that's you weerdybeerdy bork bork bork, and you too Serrh8tred.

Democommie, both oral and anal sex are enjoyed by BOTH men and women. Let's not preten that prostate stimulation is not sometimes pleasant for those who have that anatomy.

The reality is that men who orgasm more often - and that includes prostatic stimulation derived orgasm - are 30% less likely to develop prostatic cancer or other prostate problems.

Male or female, straight or hetero, solo or partnered, sex is GOOD FOR YOU, as an adult.

Don't get me started on the wonderful benefits to women's skin from certain semen components... so the sex is only for procreation can go......procreate with themselves. Hint- it's called spermidine:

There are benefits from orally consuming semen as well.(look up something for yourself, for pete's sake)

Having started out life as a city kid, I've expanded my experience with vet med training. After you've shoved your hand and arm into one of those platic gloves that go all the way up to your armpit and over your shoulder, and shoved you hand and forearm into the nearest pile of warm wet poop for lubricant (no one waste KY jelly on bovines) to artificially inseminate cows, and then shoved your arm up their rear ends so as to grab the cows cervix through the wall of the cow's digestive tract to stabilize it so you can get the insemination tube in through it using your other hand navigating through the cow's lady parts.........what people do for sexual gratification with their various orifices just doesn't seem that big a deal. And one has even less a serious concern for human morality after attaching a collection condom on a bull, stallin, or other male animal's penis, and then shoving an electro-ejaculation device into the rear ends of male large animals for semen collection, and then giving them an electric zap that would raise and lower your garage door, causing them to ejaculate for subsequent storage and AI.

Reality is that in nature, the animal world has plenty of same-sex attracted partners and plenty of same-sex attracted successful parents too. (I love science; it is so NOT stuffy and prudish like religion.) To borrow a phrase from a title of something I wrote on penigma - God doesn't hate gay humans, gay bottlenose dolphins or gay penguins. He/She/They made them that way because they want them that way.

Given the behavior of our fellow primates, as well as the animal world generally, it is obvious that same sex attraction is normal and innate. It's our human homophobia that is a bad but entirely learned or acquired problem.

dog gone said...

Hey democommie, the bottom feeders are trying to be funny.

Apparently Scared H8tred wants to see what I do for an encore after he made offensive statements that apparently got his arse in trouble last time with me (which would be all of him, not the usual more specific physical location).

Apparently he worked at the same location as another commenter over on MikeB's blog; AND was stupid enough to make those offensive comments from his place of employment.

So when the IP information was provided, both of them got in trouble. However I was willing to verify that the OTHER guy wasn't the one who was out of line.

Sheesh; these guys sure have a flat learning curve, don't they?
They appear to be uneducable, making the same mistakes over and over....

What fools these gunzombies be, to paraphrase the bard.

democommie said...

Dog gone:

It's certainly okay with me if you put comments on here, but the thread is two years old or thereabouts and only you and I can see the comments without going down post by post.

If you'd like to cross post something about teh gunzloonz, feel free. I will tell you upfront that serr8turd, weerdy', mikeyw and their fellow travellers are effectively banned from commenting on the subject of gunz, here. I told them that over two years ago and my stance is unchanged.

I just copy their comments to a separate file and shitcan them from the comments thread.